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ChuwiHI13 and the Keyu battery charger

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szucsi|Post time:10-11-2017 23:59:28 View:1338|Reply:69

amichael| Post time 10-4-2017 21:04:55 | Show all posts
MemberChuwi replied at 10-4-2017 14:12
Which batches were affected? ;-)

Wished there was a more rugged additional old style charging only  ...

You can test this yourself. Charge your tablet (if you feel safe doing so) until it warms up in that area, then disconnect the power. Pull gently on the USB's metal cladding and see if it detaches or bends or wiggles. If so, your charger is garbage and you shouldn't have been using it!

It won't charge without 12 V, so normal USB B won't work. You're best off getting a proper USB C charger.
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MemberChuwi| Post time 10-5-2017 10:27:53 | Show all posts
Why no optional simple charging port?
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MemberChuwi| Post time 10-5-2017 10:36:27 | Show all posts
Heck, is there a campaign to sell inatek chargers... ;-)

If a plug heats so much that it melts glue ore something this sounds lie a design flaw, too high current fot too tijy contacts... heck up to 100W over such a microscopic connector sounds kind of insane. That's nearly 7A @ 15V. Probably these plugs are designed to fail?

Didn't notice much temperature with my tablet. Will check the plug for noticeable heat. Think it's more likely that the glue does not adhere to the metal too well an a bit mechanical strsss can loosen it?!
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szucsi| Post time 10-5-2017 22:26:41 | Show all posts
Edited by szucsi at 10-5-2017 22:29

A USB-C socket is not designed for 60w battery charging. Although Taiwani Etrontech inc. this IC has been developed to handle up to 25 volts. It's an interesting try and a good idea. In practice, however, the USB connectors are not designed for this purpose. This is a perfect connection for high-speed data transfer, eg HDMi etc.
12 volt battery charging, it would be a good idea to build a standard charging connector. This Hi13 is a very good tablet PC. But since this is how the motherboard manufacturers have solved the battery charging, it is capable of being flammable. Think of consumers who are not familiar with electronics. Any time the charging line can shake it and there is trouble. If that does not change, soon the European market will be banned. For Chuwi, I do not think this is missing.

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MemberChuwi| Post time 10-6-2017 00:09:55 | Show all posts
I am not sure if an Inateck Charger will better the general USB C plug/cable problem in terms of charging/power supply hazards.

Just asked on amazon if Inateck's 45W model supports 12V/2A charging - as this is not noted in the sale description.  Reply from Inateck: "does not work"!

So what? Does the charger fall back to specified 9V supply with increased charging time or does it not work at all with Hi13?

I also considered the recommended RawPower Powerbank. Same question put on amazon. Ambiguous answer... Is "compatible"?! What does this mean? I'm picky here, sounds again like fallback... does it?

Or does Hi13 probably provide faster charging when using stronger 3rd party adapters?

However, both products come with cables that look better on images (like injection molded housings) - but who knows if these images show the real deal... on the other hand are two tiny USB C connections in general more reliable than one?... haven't seen USB C multifunction hubs with separate cables yet. USB C looks extremely delicate to me, cables as short as possible and avoiding plug points. Need longer cables? Better forget about an additional extension cable.

Guess the situation with USB C is unpleasing at best. Still think a simple dedicated two pole charching port would better suit a budget product. Some standard USB 3 ports in the Hi13 would be much more usable. USB C is a highend toy for highend products where additional cables and boxes for a couple of 100 bucks aren't a big factor...

There is already some bad USB 3 sfuff around, interfering with WiFi, Bluetooth and what not if shilding isn't perfect... of course we need more like this, do we? ;-)
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amichael| Post time 10-6-2017 14:12:32 | Show all posts
Edited by amichael at 10-6-2017 14:19

All proper USB 3.1 Type C cables support up to 3 A. If you're using 12 V, that's a maximum of 36 W. You'd need a 20V device to reach 60 W from regular USB Type C.(Wait, USB 3.1 Type C cables might only need to support 1.5 A.)

USB PD 2.0 supports up to 5 A, but that depends on the exact design. Most likely, devices will continue with a limit of 3 A. My RavPower battery supports a maximum current of 2 A, which means I could charge a functional Hi13 at 24 W. That's equal to the KEYU charger.

The problem is that these chargers might not be USB Certified, and so the cables or the connectors may not be robust. When dealing with higher voltages, it's very important to make sure everything is sturdy so lines don't get crossed.
The situation was already bad with cheap USB cables not working at all. Now they can damage our systems!
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MemberChuwi| Post time 10-11-2017 11:22:52 | Show all posts
I messed up some points I have to correct now. Recommend was an Aukey charger, which supports 12V/2A charging on paper. Inatec does not.

Meanwhile I orderd Aukey PA-Y8 27W which should do on Paper. If I'm right it's even PD 3 compliant. Will check this soon.

I also ordered RawPower 'USB-C quick charge cable' model RP-TPC001. Looks well on paper. US Product (made in china too?) if I'm right.

I stumbled over the official USB certification site. PD is complex. There are not only fixed voltage modes but variable voltage too (50mV steps) and even constant curre t modes... if this is easy I'm Santa... these are properties close to programmable lab supplies.

Thing one problem is that USB C refers just to the plug but does not tell anything else. Marketing mixes this up with USB 3 features, where 3.1 means nothing special 3.0 can't do... there are even USB-C devices that only provide USB 2. Another problem is that nor Chuwi neiter Aukey provide official USB compliance logos on their packaging - so you finally end up guessing.

I agree that proper USB-C plugs (and proper cable with chips according the standard) are essential.

I'm still in doubt if there is anything wrong with the original charger beyond the USB C plug quality issue. I take reports serious but it's not obvious to me if it's more than a case of some bad luck events. Power adapters sometimes completely fail, that's nothing that can't happen either. Think the problem is that Chuwi does simlpy  not take care of these rare cases...

Finally the point is where to get 'certified' products... on Amazon almost anything offered there looks chinese. The tablets connectors do not look like high end quality too. So I stick with my opinion it would be more appropriate for budget products to have a separate simple charging port. USB-C plugs are overhyped imho... and most around seems to be overpriced.
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MemberChuwi| Post time 10-11-2017 11:29:43 | Show all posts
Concerning the RawPower battery, does this output 12V/2A ?  On paper it does not and reseller told me the same a d not compatible with Hi13.

I considered this powerbank too, but dropped the idea because on paper it might not work.
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MemberChuwi| Post time 10-11-2017 23:39:33 | Show all posts
Running port checks.

Good news, no problems with USB-C data transfer found so far, using a simple USB-C otg adapter cable, nor with old usb 2 flash drives neither with a mechanical 2.5" USB 3 harddrive that might draw more power.

SD card slot works ok too. Not sure how fast this can go, have just slow old stuff laying around.

So my personal first finding is: the original charger does not destroy the tablet's USB-C port as lon as the charger's plug is fine.
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MemberChuwi| Post time 10-11-2017 23:59:28 | Show all posts
In general my inspections of USB-C plugs with a magnifier seems to turn out two basic constructions.

One trustworthy looking ones have spacer bars between contacts. This seems to make it very unlikely to get crossing contacts as bending sideways is practically impossible. That type of plug is found with my original chuwi adapter cable (which I'm still not sure which purpose Chuwi dedicates it to) as well as on the RawPower charging cable I ordered lately.

The other type seems to have weak contact guides that makes it more probable that bending sideways is possible when you wiggle the plug sideways. I guess this was constructed with data transfer only in mind, not charging. Unfortunately this type of plug is found with the original charger. A similar type has been used kn the Aukey otg adapter cables I ordered lately. This plug type works nevertheless as long as you treat it with care.

I've read recencions of products using either type reporting loosening of plugs/cables and plugs not fitting snug. Even with expensive apple cables...

So my conclusion concerning USB-C connectors is, it's not a very rugged thing. Try to get plugs with spacer bars between contacts. Most plugs and cables work somehow but you'll newer exactly know what you get. It seems to be necessary or at least good practice to frequently check the state of contacts inside plugs without spacer bars (like attached to chuwi's charger's  cable) and to check for loosening parts with all types.
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